under the radar

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Posts by under the radar

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  4

  The slave will be beaten with many strokes

  by poopie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the slave that understood but did not get in line.

  god is tired of cruel unloveing behavior now time for that beating

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  under the radar

  The best "safe word" I've ever heard is, "Do me, do me, do me!"
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  27

  Watchtower sued for Racketeering in California

  by under the radar in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  a little birdie informed me that a lawsuit against the watchtower bible & tract society, its legal department, and several individuals (perhaps lawyers in the legal department) has been filed in the superior court of the state of california, county of los angeles for, wait for it.... racketeering!.

  that's right, folks, you heard it here first.

  i have no other information, other than the case was stamped "aug 07 2015" and the docket number appears to be bc590675.

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  under the radar

  A little birdie informed me that a lawsuit against the Watchtower Bible & Tract Society, its Legal Department, and several individuals (perhaps lawyers in the Legal Department) has been filed in the Superior Court of the State of California, County of Los Angeles for, wait for it...

  RACKETEERING!

  That's right, folks, you heard it here first. I have no other information, other than the case was stamped "Aug 07 2015" and the docket number appears to be BC590675. The plaintiff is listed as Terry M. Chastain. I have no idea who that is, or anything else about the case.

  If one of you legal eagles knows how to get a copy of the complaint, please do so and post it, or at least a link to it, here so we can all enjoy.

  Racketeering? Hmmm... This could be very interesting indeed.
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  14

  Adjourned...........not over.

  by umbertoecho in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  jehovahs witnesses hearing adjourned.

  6 august, 2015. .

  the hearing into the jehovahs witnesses has adjourned until further notice.case study 29 into the jehovahs witnessescommenced on monday 27 july 2015, inquiring into jehovah's witnesses and watchtower bible and tract society of australia ltd.further information regarding this public hearing will be announced in due course.. .

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  under the radar

  For what it's worth, I emailed the Royal Commission last night and almost immediately got a standard reply that it had been received and would be reviewed.

  I wanted them to know that even when JW's comply with mandatory reporting laws, they are instructed to do so anonymously from a public (not personally identifiable) phone. I believe this constitutes obeying the "letter of the law" while thwarting and flouting the "spirit of the law." I included a copy of the infamous 1993 Child Abuse Telememo for reference.

  I acknowledged that I do not know for sure if this guideline is still in use here in the US, or was ever used in Australia. From what I've seen so far of the RC, I believe they will at least look into it. Who knows what they will find?

  I copied the document I sent the RC from Barbara's book Secrets of Pedophilia in an American Religion. If anyone has a clear original of this document, please forward it to the RC. If you prefer not do to so yourself, PM me to let me know how I can get it from you and I'll forward it myself.
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  82

  Quality Thinking - Warning: Long Post Ahead

  by Viviane in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  recently, several threads have had some debate about logic, evidence, critical thinking and skepticism.

  i wanted to write a post discussing those things, hopefully to clarify what those things are, why they are important and how to use those tools.

  first, logic, at its core, is simply a method for how to reason validly, how to draw conclusions based on a premise.

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  under the radar

  For what it's worth, I am now an official fan of Viviane and LisaRose.

  I have always admired people who could think logically and critically without allowing personal bias to skew their conclusions. Viviane's initial post in this thread is probably the best explanation of what it means to think logically that I have ever come across. Not only that, she writes clearly and concisely, with good grammar and punctuation to boot! Now that's an educated person!

  Now don't think that, just because the two I mention in this post are women, I think they're exceptional because they are women and yet have these amazing qualities. That's not correct. I think they're exceptional among humans in general, and just happen to be women. From just what I've seen lately, it seems they could reason and write circles around many so-called "learned men."

  I happen to be commercial airline pilot. My company has many female pilots, and a good number of them are captains, some younger but far senior to me in tenure. I haven't flown with them all, but the vast majority of the ones I've had the pleasure of working with have shown their reasoning, judgment, and skill to be the match of any man's, including my own.

  I think the Australian Royal Commission has brought up several good points that the Society ought to consider. One is that they should consider allowing women to be decision-makers in certain matters, and maybe even elders entrusted with teaching the congregation. The Society doesn't enforce certain aspects of Paul's misogynistic attitude, such as requiring a woman to "remain silent" in the congregation and "ask her husband" if she wants to learn anything. In that matter, they realize that society in general has progressed and so they allow women to comment at meetings and give demonstrations of preaching and teaching, if not directly teaching the congregation per se. But then they feel eternally bound by Paul's specifications that an elder must "be a husband of one wife" and "have his household in subjection," and his insistence that he does not allow a woman "to exercise authority over a man." The kindest thing you can say about this policy is that it's inconsistent. The teaching itself is arbitrary and totally baseless and inapplicable in modern society. We should have outgrown this aspect of early Christian mores just as we have that of slavery. It simply has no place in the 21st century.

  Speaking of "subjection," the way the Society applies it in the family and congregation is patently outdated. It is true that in some situations, there must be a final authority. For example, even though I am a captain myself, sometimes I am assigned as a relief pilot on long flights. The captain assigned as pilot-in-command could easily, and actually has been on some of my flights, a female. That means that even though I am a captain myself, she is "directly responsible for, and is the final authority as to, the operation of the aircraft." That applies even if she is junior to me on the seniority list, and even when she is on a break and I am actually occupying the captain's seat during my turn at the controls. That means that, by federal regulation, unless some emergency exists and she is not available, I must defer to her if there is a difference in preference or professional opinion over two acceptable courses of action. I am secure enough in my own knowledge, experience, and skill that this is no problem for me. I don't feel it threatens my "manhood" at all. Being "in subjection" to her during the flight allows for it to proceed in a safe and orderly manner. You might even say "decently and by arrangement."

  It did not always go this smoothly when women first began appearing in airline cockpits. It used to be a very "macho" environment, pretty much an "old boys' club." But then crews began to get training on how to lead, and be led, in a cooperative environment where egos were to be put aside and decisions made based on what was best for the situation at hand, and not necessarily on who was the most senior or had the most testosterone.

  The Society could learn from this. I think some women could make fine elders, just like some men do. Conversely, some women are just not suited to have great authority or make crucial decisions that affect others, just like some men are not. The standards for being appointed an elder, or anything else for that matter, should be the same. Either one meets the standards or one does not. Gender should not be a factor. It will take a sea change in the Society's attitude and much training for those used to the "old way" for this to ever work. But the airline industry is one example that shows it can work.

  Please submit 2¢ for this valuable and insightful pontification.
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  12

  I wonder are they connected

  by mana11 in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i just couldn't help myself... i had to join these images....

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  under the radar

  Ol' Baphomet is up to his old tricks, I see.

  Here's a little background on the statue, in case anyone's interested.

  
  http://www.metrotimes.com/Blogs/archives/2015/06/18/the-satanic-temple-to-unveil-baphomet-monument-in-detroit
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  36

  Family Reuinion and Being Disfellowshipped (sorry...but it's long)

  by babygirl30 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it has been a long looong time since i posted on here, but never ceased reading all the posts and keeping up on the changes that have been going on!

  but it just seems that now i have a need to get something off my chest, and this is the one place that will most definitely understand the topic at hand.

  i have been disfellowshipped for about 8yrs now, and have dealt with the 'consequences' of that decision: all my so-called friends in the org left and i was also abandoned by my own family.

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  under the radar

  I am so proud of you for standing your ground and holding your head high at the family reunion. You go, girl!

  Actually, your parents' actions had the opposite effect of what they intended. Their cold and unloving attitude gave a "bad witness" and brought "reproach on Jehovah's name." You dad's unappreciative and self-righteous shunning of you after you "saved his bacon" by bringing the forgotten meat was noted and commented on. Then when he lied about his reasons for treating you that way, he undermined whatever vestige of respect the others may have had for him and his beliefs before. The fact that he felt the need to deny that he was obeying a major teaching of his religion put it in a bad light as well. It exposed the hypocrisy of the "one true religion™."

  Your sister is in a tough spot. Maybe one day you can be completely reconciled. It's shameful the way your parents are coercing her into going along with them.

  Frankly, I'm surprised your parents even showed up once they knew you were coming. Some JW's in my family have tried to guilt me into not coming to family events by saying that if I did, they would not be able to. They did succeed in keeping me from the gathering that followed my dad's memorial service by threatening to create a scene. I guess they were afraid my "apostacooties" would contaminate the JW family and friends who would be there, even though it was at a public restaurant. When my aunt passed away, my sister treated the other family members to dinner after the service but was adamant that no one was to tell me about it, even though I had flown in from 1500 miles away, rented a car, and booked a hotel room just to be at the service. Not everyone agreed with excluding me, but no one spilled the beans. I found out later. As an aside, my aunt's will had been changed within the last year to name only one beneficiary. Guess who it was...

  Anyway, I decided that from then on, I would go to whatever family events I was invited to without regard to who else was coming or not coming. If someone didn't want to show up because I might be there, so be it. Their loss.

  About a year ago, there was big reunion for family on my mother's side. None of the JW's showed up, though to be fair, some had perfectly valid reasons why they couldn't make it. Regardless, my Extremely Significant Other and I attended and we were embraced with the love and kindness and hospitality you would expect at a family reunion, all from "worldly" relatives. Draw your own conclusion.

  Congratulations for standing up for yourself, and for helping your family see the truth about how your parents are treating you and the real reason why. You're an inspiration to everyone here.

  Thank you so much for sharing this story. Let us know how things go.
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  116

  You Tube Video Ex-Betheliite Ex-Walkill Worker Layed Off!

  by cha ching in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i am not sure if this guy is really from bethel, or walkill, but if he is....this poor guy really tells it like it is from the heart.

  he was surprised.. at the 'oh so fast, pack your bags, get your stuff outta here' layoff !.

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uk1xh1egjcu

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  under the radar

  I'm glad he shared this and that someone found it and posted it here.

  Obviously, none of us know the full circumstances, but I too am appalled at the callous and unloving way this was handled. A few years ago, the same thing happened to an acquaintance who was a long-time Bethelite but had reached the age where they begin to view people as liabilities more than productive drones. He absolutely refused to acknowledge the term "downsizing." He said, "That's a worldly term!" He just resolutely accepted that he was being "reassigned" to the field. His words said one thing, but his face said another. No adequate notice, no severance, no assistance finding lodging or employment, no moving assistance, no nothing. Just "Have a nice day and don't let the door hit you on the way out." Poor guy.

  I hope Marcus did better than he. I wish him good luck with the rest of his life, whatever direction it takes.
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  9

  The WT Trucking Outfit Has Violations

  by cattails in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  2. total number of vehicle inspections for the measurement period.

  n. fatigued truck driving (hours-of-service) basic serious violation indicator (y = serious violation within previous 12 months).

  n. kingdom support services inc truck driver fitness data.

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  under the radar

  That's actually a very good record. Of course, it needs to be viewed in the light of:

  (1) Not EVERYTHING the Society does is underhanded and duplicitous. Heck, even the Nazis dressed sharp, created the VW bug, built the Autobahn, etc. Of course, that doesn't even come CLOSE to ameliorating the evil teachings they promote and the real damage they do to ordinary people. Hmmm... is there a parallel here?

  (2) The Society has powerful financial reasons to comply with trucking regulations. There are no customers demanding refunds for late shipments, no drivers or mechanics clamoring for overtime. Fines for repeated or egregious violations can be quite heavy. And if, as I believe, they are self-insured, any losses from accidents and/or lawsuits therefrom could be very expensive. It's just good sense to play by the rules. Nobody ever said the Society was stupid with their money.

  That said, I believe the Society as it exists now is driven by two overriding prime directives:

  (1) Protect their financial interests through the use of shell corporations, secrecy and coverups anywhere exposure could cost them money, obfuscating the lines of authority by having positions such as pioneers and ministerial servants appointed locally or by traveling overseers instead of by the branch (so they can deny liability or responsibility for their actions), publishing self-serving written instructions that seem to establish one policy (reporting child abuse, for example) while verbally giving off-the-record conflicting instructions about the real way it's to be done, pressuring those injured on Society property or projects not to file lawsuits or even request medical expenses from them but instead to use their own personal health insurance, claiming that an individual's field service is a personal ministry and not a required or sponsored activity (so they can deny liability or responsibility for anything that might happen), and on and on...

  (2) Accumulate as much wealth as possible as quickly as possible while not appearing to do so. The recent money grab and land grab is a spectacular example of this greed. Most regular JW's don't even realize what happened. And fewer still have any idea of its magnitude. They were screwed over royally and don't even know it. And there are other underhanded schemes like determining the amount a circuit is to donate to the Society from the proceeds of a given assembly in order to guarantee there will be a "deficit" early on the last day and thus manipulate the "brothers" into contributing more, pressuring members into using only certain hotels so the Society can get kickbacks, making individuals buy their own trolley carts and furnish their own literature and then demanding that any contributions be turned over in full, etc., etc.

  The Society is run by lawyers and accountants. Any pretense at a "spiritual" purpose is a sideshow, a distraction to hide what it's really about.
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  7

  Grieving for the Living

  by StinkyPantz2.0 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i originally wrote this blog a few years ago, but yesterday a friend that is struggling to decide whether or not she will tell her family that she no longer accepts the jehovahs witness religious doctrine reminded me of it so i am re-sharing (with updates).. its not always completely freeing to come out of the closet (as an atheist in my case) and i wanted her to understand that.. i had a very strange realization recently: i dont know what its like to be someones adult child.

  my parents didnt get the privilege of seeing me come of age.

  i didnt get walked down the aisle when i got married.

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  under the radar

  That was a very poignant post. Thanks for sharing. There are far too many situations like yours, with varying totality and severity, all over the world. It's not just the JW's. Many other "Christian" and non-Christian groups have similar religion-over-family policies. In some places, those who dare reject the faith of their parents can be literally murdered with impunity, just like it was among "God's people" in the good ol' Bible days.

  Organized religion is a festering cancerous sore on the face of humanity, and it's high time we outgrew it.

  I am so sorry for your loss. Actually, it's their loss. You have risen above their petty superstitions and prejudices. Congratulations.

  But still, I feel and share your sadness. They know not what they do.
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  57

  Shall I go to the meeting? Would you?

  by KateWild in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  hi guys,.

  i might go to the meeting.

  i stopped going in my heart properly in nov 2013, but i went to a couple of meetings to support a love one that was df'd and tried to teach them a little ttatt.. now another df'd loved one is coming to see me today and will likely encourage me to try and get ri'd, and i want to support her.

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  under the radar

  Hi Kate. I think Flipper is onto something. He's absolutely right that it's your decision and yours alone to make. But may I offer three things to consider?

  (1) If you go back to meetings, even just few, or even just to give a little comfort and support to a friend, it could set you back emotionally and psychologically. Can you risk that at this point?

  (2) It might send the wrong message to your precious children. It might seem to say that you're not really sure about the Society and your decision to leave. It could be confusing to them, especially your son, and undermine all you've done to show them it's a mind-controlling cult masquerading as the "true religion." If word does get back to your ex, you can be sure he'll twist the circumstances and use it to undermine and discredit you personally.

  (3) If you and your friend sit together at the meeting, it's entirely possible that you both will be counseled that associating with a disfellowshipped person, even if you're disfellowshipped yourself, is "bad association" and will hinder (if not prevent) your being considered for reinstatement. Ridiculous and petty, but true. If your friend is serious about being reinstated, this could ruin your friendship. She may choose to shun you in order to appear more righteous and repentant to the Elders™. It has happened before, believe me.

  Several have suggested that you meet with her in a casual setting away from the Kingdom Hall. I think that's a great idea. You'll both feel freer to express what you're really thinking, and be able to visit and talk unconstrained by the fear that candid comments might come back to haunt you.

  Whatever you decide, good luck to you. And congratulations on reestablishing contact with your friend.